The Dos and Don'ts of Advocacy with Chandler Mulvaney

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Chris  00:17

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Shaye Koester  00:08

Hey, hey, it's Shaye Koester and I'm your host for the Casual Cattle Conversations podcast where we foster innovation and enthusiasm in the ranching industry through sharing the stories and practices of different ranchers and beef industry leaders. Be sure to be a greater part of this podcast and become involved on my social media pages. Follow @cattleconvos on Instagram, Facebook and Tik Tok or Shaye Koester on LinkedIn to join the conversations around the challenges we face as ranchers and how we can overcome them. You can also find more information about this podcast all my episodes and how to partner with me on this show, by going to my website, casualcattleconversations.com. With that, thanks for tuning in, and let's see who our guest is today. Hey folks, thanks for tuning in for another episode of Casual Cattle Conversations. If you are returning welcome back and if you are new, welcome to the show. Be sure to follow @cattleconvos on social media so I can get to know you a little bit and learn how I can better serve you. Remember that this is more than a podcast. I have now introduced RancherMind events which are mastermind events for ranchers that give you the ability to improve your operation and lifestyle while taking an hour to share laugh and relax too. If you want these episodes and more information sent to your inbox, please be sure to go to casualcattleconversations.com/newsletter To have all information sent straight to you. With that, let's get on with the episode and listen to our guest, Chandler Mulvaney. Chandler is the director of grassroots advocacy and spokesperson development for NCBA. Today, we are going to visit with Chandler about how to become better advocates and what being an advocate for agriculture truly means. This episode will leave you with some action steps to get started with your journey as an advocate and help you understand which advocacy style may be best for you. With that, let's hear what Chandler has to share with us.  With that, thank you for coming on the show today and so just to get started, would you please talk about your background in the beef industry?

 

Chandler Mulvaney  02:35

Yeah, I'd be happy to share yeah, thanks for having me on your podcast. It's definitely exciting to be here this afternoon. For those listening, my name is Chandler Mulvaney and I'm originally from a small town called Beauregard, Alabama. It's located just right outside of Auburn, Alabama, where the university is so if we've got any Auburn University graduates listening, then I'm sending you a warm War Eagle your way but I grew up on a small purebred polled Hereford cattle operation in Beauregard, Alabama, and very, very fortunate to be a part of that kind of club calf environment by selling and then raising our animals to then end up in kind of 4-H and FFA realms and throughout the southeast. So that's kind of how I got my start and was very fortunate to have a dad who, who's also a professor at Auburn, who kind of started my passion for animal science and talking about issues and the world of advocacy. So from a from a very early age, I was roaming the halls of Auburn University and I'm able to kind of get a larger grasp of of the agricultural and science world at that younger age.

 

Shaye Koester  03:51

Would you please talk today about what your current position is?

 

Chandler Mulvaney  03:55

I'd be happy to. So I recently started with the National Cattlemen's Beef Association has their director of grassroots advocacy and spokesperson development. And we like to give some really long and fancy titles here at NCBA. But I'm really excited to help lead our advocacy program. So primarily working with our Masters of Beef Advocacy program, and our advanced training for our what used to be called the Top of the Class program, working with our state partners. So those state beef councils, state affiliates, breed associations, and then any external partner so whether it's other commodity groups or trade associations, working with them on providing some sort of very general kind of starter beef advocacy training all the way to spending a lot of intimate time with some of those top level advocates who go on to represent National Cattlemen's Beef Association, either in person, media placements, could be online or on our own Cattlemen to Cattlemen show here in Denver.

 

Shaye Koester  05:03

Oh, that's awesome. Would you explain a little bit about what the MBA program is? I know I've gone through it, but some of our listeners probably haven't.

 

Chandler Mulvaney  05:12

Yes, no, I'd be happy to. So the Masters of Beef Advocacy or the MBA program started in 2009. And today, we have a little over 19,000 graduates from across the United States. I believe, Texas, Iowa and Nebraska are actually our top three states with the most amount of graduates. So if you're listening in from Nebraska, then you can take pride in knowing you're right there at the top. But it was a program started initially to provide not only just a basic awareness of the advocacy to consumers, but also provide that education and information to our producers about how cattle are raised the different types of environments that cattle are raised in throughout the United States. And then just gain that information regarding how to talk to consumers and share information in sound bites, so 25 to 30 seconds, that really helped create those meaningful and impactful conversations. So over the past 10 plus years, it's been updated several times. And right now we have what's called MBA next gen. So if you've taken one of the previous MBA certifications, and haven't heard of MBA next gen, then you can go out and get recertified. A lot of information is just simply updated with the latest USDA, as well as NCBA talking points regarding beef production, climate change, environmental sustainability, the various topics that are discussed in the MBA next gen modules.

 

Shaye Koester  06:55

Well, awesome, thank you for explaining more of that. I know, I've gone through it like, twice, like once in junior high. And then like, once when I got into college, and I enjoyed it both times. So I got a lot out of it.

 

Chandler Mulvaney  07:07

Good, good. Yeah, it's it's definitely something I think, you know, if you were to take it every every three or four years, then it's going to be outdated. So it's, it's a good timing for you to kind of keep that in your back pocket and use it as a resource. And you can always go in and review the information that's in the MBA next gen.

 

Shaye Koester  07:24

Absolutely. So as we're talking about advocacy, that's something we're really seeing a lot of on social media, we look at these social media influencers and a lot of people who are spreading the message there, which is an awesome way to reach broad audiences. However, social media is not the best method for everyone. So what does advocacy look like outside of the social media space?

 

Chandler Mulvaney  07:48

Yeah, that's, that's a phenomenal question. And it's something that we talk a lot talk about a lot during our in person trainings with state level advocates and those community based advocates within the beef community. So you're exactly right, Shaye, you know, advocacy looks incredibly different from your position to where I'm at, in my season of life, to a producer that might be managing a couple 100 acres or 1000 acres. So it's important to acknowledge that just understand that, you know, hey, advocacy is different. And actually, during our advocacy trainings that I conduct at either a national or state level, kind of one of my favorite questions to ask either in a group or individual activity is, you know, what does advocacy look like to you? And oftentimes, it's, it's really interesting to kind of hear the different responses, especially in today's climate, now getting everything from, oh, you know, advocacy looks like activists, you know, holding signs and marching for a cause. To, you know, advocacy looks like writing a blog or sharing your message in an online format, or making a series of posts on Instagram for, you know, maybe it's counteracting some misinformation online. So it's really interesting just to see the different perspectives and the different lenses in which people view advocacy. So it's important for us to just say, hey, you know, advocacy is different. And I love using my form of advocacy as someone who represents cattle producers across the country, to go out and start those conversations with them and really reinvigorate and emphasize those starting points for producers.

 

Shaye Koester  09:36

So, as you have these conversations and train producers, what would you say are some of the challenges producers face with starting these conversations?

 

Chandler Mulvaney  09:46

Yeah, that's a that is a tough question to answer for sure. I really don't think there's there's one specific silver bullet to starting those conversations. Overcoming that challenge. There's actually a quote that I heard recently from, from Norman Webb, who kind of in the academic world founded the theory of the depth of knowledge. And he says, we don't need to teach people more things, we need to teach people deeper things. And so I think when it comes to the world of advocacy, we oftentimes forget that there's a lot of information out there. And there's a lot of starting points that you as a producer, or as a college student, or whatever stage of life, you're in that, that really, if you kind of throw a dart at the board, we can probably make an educated guess and say, this is going to be where I'm going to start. And this is, this is going to have impact for me, and probably be right. And so focusing in on, on where you can deepen your knowledge and grow yourself in that kind of sphere of influence that you have as an advocate. So whatever community you are ingrained in focusing on that community, deepening your knowledge, and then starting to slowly expand that knowledge to other communities, is just a really important starting place. And for a lot of our advocates at the state level, who haven't even completed their Masters of Beef Advocacy, or might be in college and looking for that next opportunity, they're really biggest thing is just, it's just starting and taking that first step. Because once you do that, it might take some time, but you're actually going to have a little bit of traction, and it's going to be easier to take that next step.

 

Shaye Koester  11:36

Oh, absolutely and that kind of goes with anything, whether that's business or advocacy, or any new talent or skill you're going to develop, you have to start with, well pick what you want to start with, and then start first

 

Chandler Mulvaney  11:48

I agree. Yeah, and keep that momentum going. Yep.

 

Shaye Koester  11:52

So how would you describe effective advocating? Because there are multiple methods that can all be effective. But what are maybe a better question is what's ineffective when it comes to advocating? Or what should we not do?

 

Chandler Mulvaney  12:09

Yeah, that's a that's a really important question and one that I don't think we talked about enough. One of my favorite quotes that I oftentimes share in our trainings and just in kind of one off conversations with individuals who are are looking to get started in their advocacy journey. It's really focused on asking the right questions and focusing on the person at the opposite end of the table or the other side of the conversation. And so the quote is, "It's not their job to understand you, it's your job to understand them."  And so if we really put our focus and our energy on understanding the people who are there willing to have a conversation with us, that oftentimes we're going to have a greater opportunity to impact the movable middle. So those are the people that are people who haven't really made up their mind or finalize their perception of their belief on a particular matter. So specific to the beef community, those are the people that we can influence their buying habits or their purchasing habits at the grocery store. And in turn, potentially have them share some of their success stories or for their insights as advocates in a different community or different walks of life, about the fan and all the benefits it provides. So I really think it's important for us to put that focus on the person on the other side of that conversation. And so when we ask the right questions, we're building an environment of trust, where we're showing that we care, and we're showing that we're capable and not just being one sided in our conversation, and solely talking about all the great things that are impactful things that you've done as a producer or a member of the beef community. And so oftentimes, it's important for us to recognize that emotions and that connection with people make more of an impact than just sharing sheer facts, or your knowledge or information with someone. So start with asking the right questions, and I really think that'll help create some really meaningful conversations.

 

Shaye Koester  14:21

Certainly, it's all about being interested in not interesting. So do you have like three to five best practices you'd be willing to share when it comes to advocating?

 

Chandler Mulvaney  14:35

Yes, you know, I think if you were probably asked me on a different day, I might have a different answer. So there's, there's a lot of really great tips for getting started on your advocacy journey. A few that I'll share for today, as you go out and start crafting that message. I really like to think about you as an advocate and asking the write questions. So if you have a journal or you have a notebook that you'd like to spend some time writing some thoughts in, or maybe it's a Google document, just ask yourself some of the following questions, you know, What story do I have to tell as an advocate? Go ahead and answer that question. And then ask yourself another and what gaps or opportunities exist within my own community to make an impact? And those two questions can really help you answer just some of the basic opportunities that exist the basic audiences that are available to you even in your own backyard. So if you haven't started advocating, I highly encourage that you go out and find that audience most most often your family and friends and, and share your kind of elevator speech or your  initial story as an advocate with those audiences and get some really critical feedback on what you could change what you can improve, and then go back to the drawing board. And so as you continue developing your story, it's important for you to kind of talk into lists and talk in some bullet points. And so we oftentimes share that it's important for you to make things memorable and make your messages memorable. And so last week, I was actually at the annual NCBA convention and tradeshow in Nashville and I hosted a panel with two really amazing individuals Kiah Twissleman, otherwise known as coach Kiah and then Courtney De Hoff, who is a founder of the fancy lady cowgirl movement. So we were on the trade show floor, and we're sharing these really great messages. And they're talking about their advocacy journey. And Courtney made a comment that I thought was really, really impactful. And she said, when you're starting as an advocate, it's important for you to make your mess your message. And so even if your life is a little bit messy, right now, think about those just really impactful, personal, authentic stories that you have to share, just start crafting them out on a piece of paper. So I think it's important for you to just really understand what audience you're sharing that message with. And like Courtney said, make your mess your message.

 

Shaye Koester  17:20

Yes, Courtney has been on the show before. So she does outstanding job advocating as well as Kiah.I follow her a little bit too. They are both outstanding individuals.

 

Chandler Mulvaney  17:31

Yes, they are awesome to follow and always posting some inspirational content. So go give them a follow.

 

Shaye Koester  17:37

Yes, very good at the connecting point, or the connection method?

 

Chandler Mulvaney  17:41

Definitely, I agree.

 

Shaye Koester  17:43

So you've probably talked about it a little bit, and you have touched on it in other questions, but what would you say would be the main thing that we as ranchers need to improve when it comes to advocating?

 

Chandler Mulvaney  17:57

Yeah, I think it really goes back to just asking the right questions. And so you know, I think a good spokesperson, that good advocate for the agricultural community really embodies kind of that selfless nature. And sometimes that's really difficult in our kind of, you know, gratifying world and online world that we live in, where everything is instantaneous, and based off of likes, and comments and shares. But if you're asking the right questions, to me, that shows that, again, you care about who's on the opposite end of the table. And that you care about their issues and what they're concerned about, and why they're even there in the first place asking you the question. So first of all, I think we need to, we need to reach across the table and reach across that divide and look for opportunities in our own community to share just the simple messages that we have as a producer, as a rancher or as a college student about her story. And again, I think that will showcase it's us embracing that ideology, that it's it's our job to understand them and to connect with people who are maybe a little bit concerned about how we raise our animals in a confined space, or the the types of feed stuffs that we're actually feeding our animals on a daily basis. And that, in turn, is that beef safe to feed my family. So once we want to make those connections in your everyday walk of life, it's important for you to actually start showing up. And so I think, you ask the right questions, you show that you've cared. And then once you're given that platform or that opportunity, even in your own community that you start showing up that maybe it's school board meetings, or maybe your district FFA chapter is having a meeting and they're electing officers and you have an opportunity to go share your message. Don't overlook that opportunity to impact youth or young professionals in your community. And then seek out those chances to, to expand your influence. So I love getting involved with like a chamber of commerce, or going and making a presentation with your county commissioners, because those people who have much higher level of influence in your own community, they're the ones that are making policy or really impacting change on a daily basis of what kids are eating in schools, what's being taught schools to the information that's being disseminated to those people that are moving into your community. So the more that you can access those those multiple touch points, I think those are those are oftentimes overlooked opportunities that we have not done a good enough job within agriculture community.

 

Shaye Koester  20:54

Well, thank you for sharing those tips. And bringing that to light. I think it is important, like you said, to reach out to, you know, whether it is like county commissioners or those people making policy, sometimes maybe forget about those individuals, and just how influential they may be.

 

21:11

Yeah, most definitely. And it's, it's amazing, you know, really, once you start to kind of take a step back, and you look at the communities that you're involved in, it amazes me Shaye, how I heard it last week, I think you're oftentimes just like, six times removed from knowing someone, either in the community over or maybe your neighboring states. And that same kind of application applies to other communities. So food, nutrition, or health, and being a strong advocate for the beef community, can also mean that you can be a strong advocate for some of those partnering communities as well.

 

Shaye Koester  21:51

Yeah, I mean, it's a big world, but it's a small world, that degree of separation really isn't that large, especially if you look at your Midwest states. That's a lot smaller there. And the beef industry as well. It's very interconnected. So with that, is there anything you are excited about in the advocacy space, like in the future wise, or just currently?

 

Chandler Mulvaney  22:11

Yeah, great question. You know, it's really tough to say I think advocacy is always shifting, and it's changing on a daily basis. So I always love just constantly educating and informing myself on you know, what are the latest, you know, whether it's a challenge online or new platforms. And as you begin your advocacy journey, or as you're continuing to sustain those conversations, you know, maybe as a top advocate in your own state, it's important to remember that advocacy is something that requires patience and practice. And so I didn't mention this earlier, but I kind of wanted to circle back around. I hope that's okay. But I'll make it all connect. It's so important for us to remember that advocacy requires practice and patience. And so I'm really excited for those of you that are starting or have already started, just remember that if you're starting a new platform, or you've maybe kind of hit a wall on an existing platform, maybe it's a podcast or Instagram, just keep sharing, be strategic in what you're sharing. And again, thinking those those lists and making your messages memorable. And eventually, you'll kind of crack through. You'll make that impact or cross that threshold of where you know, you start to gain a little bit more traction or followers. So it's important just to be patient, and it's not going to happen overnight, or maybe even in the course of the year. And so just remember that advocacy is always shifting. And so for me, it's exciting to see those kind of emerging advocates and seeing my opportunity working for National Cattlemen's has a chance to be a resource and serve the needs of our producers who are wanting to get engaged in those conversations, both online and in person. And then I'm really excited for for kind of expanding our partnerships and for leveraging our platform here at National Cattlemen as the leading voice for cattle producers across the country, so we've got some programs in work, I can't really share a whole lot right now. But we're excited to launch those in the coming year and really expand not only what we've continued to do over the past decade working with the Masters of Beef Advocacy program, but continue to just again, leverage our opportunities and make sure that we're offering the best advocacy programs for our producers and for consumers as well.

 

Shaye Koester  24:49

Well, awesome. So as we kind of wrap up the interview, you've obviously talked about the Masters of Beef Advocacy program as a resource, but are there any other resources that you'd really like to share to for these listeners, if they're interested in improving their advocacy.

 

Chandler Mulvaney  25:07

Most definitely, I would always love to share some resources. So I know Shaye just mentioned the Masters of Beef Advocacy as a great tool. Again, just a quick recap, you can find all the information on the MBA program at MBA.beeflearningcenter.org and I highly encourage you to complete that you can really do it in the course of an afternoon. It's a five module course, each module is about 30 minutes, and then you get tested for what you learned and what was brought to your attention through that module. So that's a great starting point for any producer, any consumer who has questions about, excuse me, maybe a gap in your knowledge about the beef community and if you've completed your MBA, what better than that, to share that as a resource within your own communities. So that's a great way to start sharing some conversations on your favorite social media platform, maybe create a series of videos or posts online and sharing that as a resource and the benefit that have brought you as an advocate within the ag community. Another couple of quick resources, BQA or beef quality assurance, if you're involved in the cattle producing community, or even if you're a transporter, or if you were going to grocery stores a butcher, any anyone that has a touch point to really that that supply chain or the American beef supply, I highly encourage you to go ahead and obtain that BQA certification. It's a little bit longer than MBA. But it's a it's such a phenomenal program. And since 1991, I believe there's been over 300,000 certifications. And it's really one of the strongest programs that have come about as a result of the Beef Checkoff and a success of the work that we've done here at National Cattlemen. So, go out, get certified in both your MBA and your BQA. And then if you're a college student, or even an aspiring advocate. Another great program that is a partner of ours is through the Animal Ag Alliance and they have two programs that I have actually been involved with, and now kind of serve as a mentor. So that that's kind of cool, coming full circle, that they have their college Aggies online, which is actually getting started, I believe applications are open up until the first part of September. So if you're a college student, and you're looking for that chance to really cultivate those conversations, build a presence online, there's really no better place than to start there and engage with your peers in a really healthy environment. And then taking it one step further is that that animal ag alliance program, and it's such a plethora of opportunities and resources of information. And that that program is actually sponsored by Zoetis. It does require a fee. But if you're looking to kind of take that next step, it's it's a great place to start. And it's definitely helped me as well in my position.

 

Shaye Koester  28:16

So awesome. That kind of concludes everything I really wanted to ask you and have you share on the show. But if you have anything else that you would like to add feel free to do so.

 

Chandler Mulvaney  28:28

Yeah, I guess it's been an absolute pleasure. As I told Shaye earlier, a little bit tired running on empty. I just came back from Nashville. We had a great week at the annual NCBA convention and trade show. And then before that had a couple of trainings with some of our state Beef Council partners. So we've been running around like crazy this past month. But I would like to share Shaye it's really important for those of you listening that if you're kind of questioning where to start and how to take that first step. By all means, contact me or contact your state Beef Council or cattlemen association. Oftentimes, people such as yourself that might be listening and want to get started never actually follow through with calling their state cattlemen, their state Beef Council and not enough people call and just ask, hey, I'm interested in learning or engaging more as an advocate. How can I best serve my state cattlemen's association? And I guarantee if you do that, you're probably going to get a very welcomed response. And people are actually going to want to maybe put you in a newspaper article or help out with a letter to the editor campaign or have you come on and do a podcast show like like Shaye and I are doing today. So I highly encourage that you just contact those individuals at your respective state. And if they don't reach back out to you that by all means I'm going to drop my email, you can contact me at cmulvaney@beef.org. And I'd be happy to put you in touch with somebody at your state level or community level, or even here at NCBA. And make sure that you have the resources you need, just to get started sharing what's most important to you?

 

Shaye Koester  30:27

Well, awesome, thank you for sharing that. And to any listeners out there, you can go ahead and reach out to me too, if you want that sent to you as well. But with that, that kind of concludes everything today. So thank you, Chandler.

 

Chandler Mulvaney  30:41

Thank you so much, Shaye.

 

Shaye Koester  30:43

And that's a wrap on that one. Remember to take action and tell the story of our industry whenever you can. It is truly up to us. If you have further questions about advocacy, do not hesitate to reach out to me via email or social media. With that, remember to follow @cattleconvos on social media, sign up for the newsletter and be a part of my next RancherMind event. You can find more information on that by following me on social media. I do have a little bit in the show notes as well. But I mostly use my social media to get things across to you. With that, take care and have a great day

 

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Greg Williams  00:12

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Greg Williams  00:45

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Performance Beef  00:54

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Policy Episode: 30 by 30

 

Shaye Koester  00:00

THIS EPISODE WAS RECORDED IN SEPTEMBER PLEASE NOT THAT POLICY IS CONSTANTLY CHANGING IN WASHINGTON D.C. Hey, Hey, it's Shaye Koester and I'm your host for the Casual Cattle Conversations podcast where we foster innovation and enthusiasm in the ranching industry through sharing the stories and practices of different ranchers and beef industry leaders. Be sure to be a greater part of this podcast and become involved on my social media pages. Follow @cattleconvos on Instagram, Facebook and Tik Tok or Shaye Koester on LinkedIn to join the conversations around the challenges we face as ranchers, and how we can overcome them. You can also find more information about this podcast, all my episodes and how to partner with me on this show, by going to my website, casualcattleconversations.com. With that, thanks for tuning in. And let's see who our guest is today. Alrighty, folks, thanks for tuning in again And joining me here today. This is a bonus episode just for you guys. I asked if you want more policy, and you said yes. So today on the show, we have Kaitlynn Glover, who is going to be sharing her knowledge and all that she knows and is available to share with us about the 30 by 30. or some of you maybe have heard it called America the Beautiful. But really, she's going to go into more depth on explaining that because she does a much better job than I ever could. So with that we are going to get on with the episode. Be sure to sign up for my newsletter, if you want episodes, and my blogs sent straight to your inbox. So you can do that on my website, casualcattleconversations.com/newsletter. But with that, as usual, give me a like share, shout out on social media. But we're gonna get on with the episode. All right, well, thanks for hopping on today. Kaitlynn, it's great to have you on here. Glad we got a meeting to work out. You're certainly busy.

 

Kaitlynn Glover  01:02

Things are things are busy here in Washington and I think never more so then this time of year when we head to the end of the fiscal year. And look how we're going to allocate funds and spend funds for the next year. This year is a little bit interesting, because we have the appropriations coming forward and a lot of these relief packages too. So this adds a little bit of complexity to all of these conversations that aren't really easy for Congress to have most years.

 

Shaye Koester  02:49

Well, I'm just glad you could be on here. We made it work through that. So to get started, would you mind sharing with my audience, you know, what is your background and ranching?

 

Kaitlynn Glover  02:59

Sure, so I am I'm a Wyoming girl, I grew up in Wyoming, in you know, in pretty rural conditions. And so I grew up surrounded and with ranchers surrounded by ranching communities by public lands and so you know, one of the hats I wear is the executive director of the Public Lands Council. So I represent ranchers, cattle and sheep producers who value unique part of their operation is that they have grazing on these federal lands for service BLM some of these partnerships with other agencies too. And so that really speaks to my background and where I grew up. I went to the University of Wyoming for my undergrad, Go Pokes, and spent a lot of time in Laramie in a little bit of different conditions, right. It's a it's high, high mountain production atmosphere, but still very much, I think, representative of the West. And then after my undergrad, I actually went to Ireland, and I worked for the semi state there. It's sort of like the USDA halfway between the USDA and our extension services but were really focused on agriculture. And when I came back, I spent some time working on the hill in politics and in policy, and which led me you know, through the years to my positions here, like I said, I'm executive director of PLC, but I also wear a second hat. I am concurrently serving as executive director of the Natural Resources Program, the policy division for the National Cattlemen's Beef Association.

 

Shaye Koester  04:36

Well, awesome, you're sure have a big role in our industry today. So with that, and within your role, would you explain what 30 by 30 is? We hear it in the news. We hear it but what is it?

 

Kaitlynn Glover  04:49

Sure. So you know, like so many things, this tagline that sort of permeated a lot of our conversations about public lands about private lands conservation management, but really what it is at its core, you know, the administration, this administration was really focused on climate, they focused on climate through the campaign. And in the early days, we knew that that concept of climate and environmental rules and regulations was going to be a huge focus. And so it wasn't really a surprise, when very early, President Biden issued an executive order. And one of those executive orders, while there were quite a few focused on these environmental footprints, and in assessing conservation, and preservation, and all of these environmental attributes, and one of the things he did was set a goal for the US to conserve 30% of our lands and waters by the year 2030. And the thing you need to know about executive orders is it's sort of like a presidential wish list, right? I want to do the thing, right, and then they look to their respective department heads or agency heads and say, now you have to figure out how to do it, right. So it's really, you know, this this sort of big idea, factory that happens to be coming out through the President's voice. And so this 30 by 30 goal, I think when it got to the departments, and it got to the agencies, they said, great, the President says 30, by 30, conserve 30% of lands and waters in the next nine years. How are we going to do it?  And I think that how we're going to do it is, is what has created a lot of the discussion over the last eight or nine months. Because he like so many things, the proof is in the pudding. Right? How do we conserve land, but you ask ranchers, and they say, well, we conserve it, because we manage it, we graze it. We manage invasive species, we do prescribed burns, you know, we do things to make the land better and healthier. That's conservation. But of course, the federal agencies in other groups, you know, they might have a different definition of conserve. So really, what this 30 by 30 is, is a goal that we have to take steps to achieve over the next nine years. Now the administration because they said we don't really quite know how to answer this question or respond to the President. They put together this taskforce. And they said, Okay, we need to, we need to reach this goal, we need to tell the president yes, we've done this, too. How do we do that. And that taskforce came up with the America the Beautiful report. And I mentioned that because now those two terms are basically used interchangeably. Your 30 by 30 goal is going to be carried out through this American beautiful campaign. The thing that's kind of special about this or unique maybe about this campaign, is it, it's the first national conservation goal this country has ever had. And so for a lot of folks, that can be scary, because it sounds like the government saying we're going to do this thing. But don't worry, we're here to help. And you know, in some of these rural places, and when the government says, I'm from the government, I'm here to help, that can be a little concerning, right. And so, you know, it's a, it's taken a little while to navigate, what that help is going to look like, and how we can be involved. But, you know, we were pretty clear in the beginning, you know, ranchers know what conservation is, and we know how to do it. And we know that it's very different from other tactics that can be taken. For example, conservation and preservation aren't the same thing. Right? Conservation is active. Preservation is taxidermy. You know, you can't set an ecosystem on a shelf. I mean, you can't set a forest or a range land or a grassland on a shelf and expect it to stay that way. And so this 30 by 30 goal, right, is this evolving target is evolving conservation target that has a, you know, the potential to be the subject of discussion, I think, for at least the next nine years, but certainly beyond into.

 

Shaye Koester  09:03

Absolutely. So thank you for really going into that and explaining especially how 30 by 30 and America the Beautiful are sometimes used interchangeably. And what that means is that it is important to understand, as we see press releases and news reports and whatnot. But so, where is the government at with this now, as far as, you know, conservation and recognizing what ranchers are already doing?

 

Kaitlynn Glover  09:31

I think that's a great question. Right. and you know, one of the things that we focused on NCBA PLC, some of our other rancher land management partners, one of the things that we told them in the beginning, we really told them four main things right, first, that they needed to be very clear that conservation and preservation are two totally separate things. Right. Conservation can include preservation, in some cases, right for, you know, national historic sites for you to preserve a building, that can be conservation of a resource. But for ecosystems, it has to be more dynamic. So they have to be really intentional about what that is. We also told them that they needed to be clear about what would count, you know, what is going to count as conserved and who has to do it in order for it to count. The third thing that was that we had to be clear about where it was going to happen. Was this all going to be on private land? Well, mathematically, that didn't quite work. Was it going to all be on public land? No, that didn't work either, because the government only owns 28.1% of lands in the United States, but had to be really clear about where it was going to happen as well. And this last thing, I think, is the most important because they have to recognize the good work that's already being done. Right. There are a lot of potential pitfalls and missteps in this America the Beautiful campaign, right, nine years is a really long time. And this is a really, really big goal. So there's a lot of potential for things to go awry, just because things can go awry in any land management scenario. But the thing that needs that I think is is so special and so unique about this proposal, is that we as producers, as as ranchers, as land managers, have the opportunity to shape the conversation about grazing activities. This could be you know, if we do this, right, this could be the first opportunity, or the first time really, that the government recognizes that grazing is conservation. Not the grazing can be used as conservation, not that it has conservation outcomes, but that grazing itself is conservation. And I think that's important, right? Because you're exactly right. Ranchers, farmers do good work all the time, you have this constant improvement. You look at a pasture and say, What can I do to make it better for next year, not just better for my cattle and my sheep? But what can I do to make that soil healthier to retain more organic matter to use resources more wisely? And so in order to do that, that definition, or that description of conservation has to be pretty broad, right? It can't just be private land conservation, things like the title to farm bill conservation programs, and there are a lot of those. And those are great, right? But it has to be those plus other things as well. We have conservation projects on BLM lands on forest lands, what are projects that make those landscapes more resilient to catastrophic wildfire or drought, the full spectrum of those things has to be included, because ranchers and farmers, and forest owners and fishers, the Fisher people, I guess, fishermen, those were, those are core conservationists that we recognize to be conservationists, but their contributions need to count and they need to be added into that total. I have to say, you know, there's, when we first started these conversations in January and February, there, there was a little bit of concern about how those contributions would be recognized. I mean, it was one of our forecasts, but you gotta count what works. But these four groups, the farmers, the ranchers, the forest owners, and the fishers, were the only four groups really to be called out in that initial report from from the government. And that's a huge win, because recognizing, we may not know how their work is going to be recognized. But the fact that they were called out in the initial report saying that they do good work, and they have to be recognized. That's really, really important. And it should give your listeners, my members a little bit of security here. Because what we've seen in the last six months is not a lot of progress. You know, I have a it's pretty easy to joke, right? The government loves, loves the task force, they love a working group, they love a meeting, right? And what they've done is put together an interagency working group members from all of the different agencies to come together to answer the questions that they didn't answer in that first report. Who's going to do the conservation? Where's it going to happen? How are we going to count it? What are we going to count it? All of those questions have to be answered. Right. And those are important questions. And so that interagency task force is going to meet quarterly. They met once already and said, We love conservation, which is about all they said, Right? Or reaffirming a commitment to that 30 by 30 goal, but not a lot of detail has come out yet. But I you know, I think I realize I'm being a little long winded here. But I think the other thing to note is that there have been some really interesting discussions from the administration about projects. They've done that they're attributing back to America the Beautiful. Because one of the things we need to remember is that the agencies and departments, they want to be able to tell the President that yes, we have achieved this goal, right? And when your boss is the President, you want to be able to say Yes, sir. Yes, ma'am. We got it done. And so they're looking for things to count against that goal. Now, the Department of the Interior, for example, is doing a lot of projects that increase hunting and fishing access or increase access, outdoor access to green space, things that maybe we wouldn't consider as conservation, but they want to count toward their goals as well. Then, you know, they're there, but not so great things. Right. You know, the President announced that September was going to be National Wilderness month, he issued another proclamation and outlined his support for designation of wilderness use of the National Wilderness tools, right for Congress and for the administration. And that's something that's pretty concerning, right, because he linked that back to the American beautiful report. And even though the administration has said, we know, or they know that this goal can't just be about preservation or about designation, having the President say that publicly is is concerning, then. So we had to pretty swiftly remind them that, you know, they have these tools at their disposal. But the quickest way to lose those four key stakeholders that they identified the fishers, the ranchers, the farmers, and the forest owners, the quickest way to do that, is to prohibit them from doing the good work that they already do. So Shaye, it's really kind of a mixed bag. Right? I mean, there has been a little bit of progress made, but it's, it's sort of progressed in, you know, in short announcements and short snippets, rather than sort of that foundational work that we had hoped to see by now.

 

Shaye Koester  16:58

Right. And, I mean, that's just something that I myself need to know, with being involved in ranching, my listeners need to know is just that it is a mixed bag. That's where it's at. So that being said, Are there actions that producers can be taking now? Or what should they be doing to help share their voice or make a difference for their in their benefit?

 

Kaitlynn Glover  17:22

That's a really good question because especially when you have a big government initiative like this, the first question is, you know, are they just going to do this to us? Or are they going to do this with us? And so I think the one of the things that producers that individual ranters can do is just keep harping on the message that we are, you know, we are climate, we're environment, we are ecosystem champions, right, you could not manage these landscapes, we say to the government, without us. And and I think it's important, you know, we're recording at the end of September, and this is national climate month. And so we're having all of these climate week discussions, and I think, you know, maybe even five years ago, talking about, you know, ranchers talking about in supporting climate week, would have raised some eyebrows and made folks a little bit uncomfortable. But the truth is that producers are the ones who take care of these lands, they take care of these waters, they manage wildlife habitat, all of these things are benefits that come from their normal practices. And so continuing to tell that message and say, you know, yeah, I'm a rancher. Yeah, I, you know, I do all these things. But because I do all these things, I'm a conservationist. And so really adopting that term and and putting it in, in sort of their ethos, right in the things that they talk about every day, I think is a really great way to just keep reinforcing the message to consumers, to local government officials, to their agency partners, that we are the ones you need to come to we are the experts here to let us get you to your 30%. Right, you don't need to do anything to us, because we've done it for you already. And I think the other thing, as well, is that, you know, a lot of the discussion so far, and I think this sort of relates to my first point here is that, you know, a lot of the discussion so far is that when this is a federal initiative, right, or a national initiative, a lot of folks have had a lot of government relay regulation, especially in the Western Midwest. The government puts restrictions on things, but pretty tight parameters on things, and in a lot of ways, really disincentivizes some of that partnership. So what I'd encourage your listeners to do is be really willing to to have that conversation, to be to be willing to say, yep, we're conservationists and you know, we're happy to lead this conversation. We're happy to talk to you about it and tell you all the good things we do. But keep having that conversation even when things get tough. Even when the President says this is natural wilderness month, and we love this tool. They know we don't love this tool, and here's why continue that conversation continue to be part of that dialogue. Because if we back out of the conversation, they're going to be people who try to fill our role. But it's not going to be to the benefit of agriculture, it's not going to be the to the benefit of food security. If we don't tell our story, no one else will and, in fact, they'll tell an adulterated version of our story, that that is is farther from the truth. And it certainly  isn't helpful. You know, we've told people for years for decades, right? That we have incredibly important expertise, that our producers are be primary stewards of these lands. And now, the proof is in the pudding. And that we in we show we continue to demonstrate and we continue to lead that conversation. You know, it's sort of like, you know, if any of your listeners have kids, right, you got to set boundaries. Here's the good line, here's the bad line. And then we want to say somewhere in the middle, right, keep it keep it between the lines here. And that's, I think, what we're trying to do with this administration, give them the expertise, tell them when they step over the line, but make sure that these initiatives that, you know, we're covering a heck of a lot of landmass, that these initiatives that are going to fact a lot of number of acres, are beneficial for the land, but for producers in long run too.

 

Shaye Koester  21:37

Well, thank you very much, is there anything else you feel like adding? I think you really covered all the bases, and I feel like I have a better understanding of it. So I'm sure my listeners will too. But if there's anything else you'd like to add, you're more than welcome to before we wrap up?

 

Kaitlynn Glover  21:53

Yeah, I mean, I think, you know just like anything, land management or resource management, you know, we talk about, you know, a lot of opportunities. And you can see me here, you can see, I'm not wearing glasses, and they're not rose colored. And so, you know, all of the good opportunities that we have here, through initiatives like this, by where we have the opportunity to have some really meaningful input and leadership. It's not all good news, right, we know that there are going to be fights ahead on things like critical habitat for endangered species. We know there are lots of fights ahead with national monuments with wilderness areas and other things. But I think it's important to remember that there are opportunities, sometimes you have to make them. But there are opportunities in any one of these proposals. Because, again, you know, this administration, any administration, the likelihood that they're going to have a cattle producer, in their staff, or in those offices. Now, there aren't very many of us, and a lot of us would much rather be out in pasture rather than in an office. And so it's incumbent upon us to tell the story and to be to be available to be engaged, because it's not always going to be good news. But you have advocates here at PLC, have advocates here at NCBA, with our partner organizations to make sure that we were drawing those lines very clearly. You know how to get ahold of me Shaye, and for your listeners, and your listeners are more than welcome to give me a call or send me an email. My email is kaitlynnglover@beef like beef, what's what's for dinner.org. And I'm happy to talk about these things anytime. You know, this is a nine year process. And you know, land is worth taking care of. Cattle and sheep, they need to stay on the landscape, that will continue to be our focus. And I look forward to talking to any of your listeners who want to make sure that the same is true in their their state.

 

Shaye Koester  24:00

Well, thank you very much for that, I'll make sure your email gets down in the show notes so that they're able to do that easily if they need to. But once again, thank you for hopping on. I'm glad we could make it work. And thank you for sharing your insight and knowledge on what 30 by 30. And America the Beautiful is so that we as ranchers can better understand where that's at.

 

Kaitlynn Glover  24:23

Well, thanks so much, Shaye. And yeah, this is going to continue to evolve. So if anybody has any questions, or you want to talk about it again in the future, I'm more than happy to do that as well. Awesome.

 

Shaye Koester  24:33

Thank you. And that's a wrap on that one. I hope you feel more informed about everything that's going on, and really got a lot out of what Kaitlynn had to share with us today. I know I really appreciated it and gained a lot of value from that conversation. Make sure you tell me what you want to hear. As well as go sign up for that newsletter. This newsletter is free and I send you The episodes straight to your inbox, as well as my blog posts. And also I'm able to connect you with some other businesses who have some resources for you. But with that, thanks for joining and I hope to see your download on the next one.