Shaye Koester (00:04):
Hey, Hey, it's Shaye Koester and I'm your host for Casual Cattle Conversations, where we are talking about all topics related to ranching, through sharing the stories and practices of different ranchers and their operations. We are building a community and fostering innovation within the ranching industry through this podcast and my social media pages. So, to be a more involved member of this community, please go check out those pages and join the conversation. Follow cattleconvos on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, Twitter, and YouTube to join in on my live events and the discussions about each episode and other topics that relate to you and your operation. Now, if you'd like to become a greater part of this podcast that is impacting all 50 states, as well as several other countries, please be sure to reach out to me via email, direct message, or you can find the necessary contact information for me by clicking the link in my social media bios, or go to my website, casualcattleconversations.podbean.com. But with that, thanks for tuning in. I'm glad to have you here and let's hear who our guest is today.
Shaye Koester (01:23):
Alrighty folks, thank you for tuning in for another episode. You asked for it and you got it. There was a request sent out a few months ago, asking for an episode on what are the differences in managing seedstock versus commercial cattle. So today on the show I brought on Steve Koester. Now, if you've been following this show for a while or have gone back and watched the beginning episodes, you know that Steve was on the beginning episode where he discusses starting a ranch from scratch, but today he's going to dive into and share his experience of transitioning from a commercial operation to a seedstock operation. We talk about the challenges, both operations face, how they can be managed differently and similarly, and Steve really just shares his honest experience and insight. At the end he really offers up some advice on what to do and really keep in mind before you start to transition or are thinking about the transition.
Shaye Koester (02:27):
So with that, thank you for tuning into the episode. And let's hear from today's sponsor.
Performance Beef (02:34):
This episode is brought to you by Performance Beef – easy-to-use cattle management software. Stop relying on pen and paper or complicated programs. Performance Beef is a comprehensive technology solution integrating feed, financial and health information in one easy-to-use platform, accessible from anywhere on your computer, smartphone or tablet. Performance Beef makes it easy to update rations; record health data at chute, in the pen or out at pasture; generate real-time closeout reports; or analyze trends in feed intake, costs and performance – all in one place. It has helped more than 2300 cattle producers simplify their cattle business. Search Performance Beef online to request a demo or follow Performance Beef on social media. https://www.performancelivestockanalytics.com/performance-beef/
Shaye Koester (03:27):
So to start off, if you could be any animal on your ranch, which one would you be?
Steve Koester (03:32):
Why? Is this a trick question?
Steve Koester (03:36):
If I could be any animal on the ranch? I would probably be my old dog. My old dog is retired, has it pretty easy, pretty much lays around, comes out and helps once in a while and has the best life ever. She gets to lay in the air conditioning too.
Shaye Koester (03:57):
That's the one right beside you?
Steve Koester (03:59):
That would be the dog laying beside me at the moment. (laughter).
Shaye Koester (04:00):
Okay. So now that we have that covered, what is your background in ranching? I have a feeling you've been at it for a while if you want to be the old retired dog.
Steve Koester (04:14):
Well, the back hurts once in a while. Yes. I'm the fourth generation. Not necessarily on this place. I grew up three miles north of where we are, but I didn't travel too far. I made it a whopping three miles away. I did work off the place once in a while. In my younger years, I was helping my dad and I worked for different companies that had been moving around the United States a little bit during the winter.
Shaye Koester (04:47):
Where those companies like ag companies or what were you doing there?
Steve Koester (04:51):
They were more in the factory-type business. If a factory went out of business the company I worked for was hired to go and move the equipment and get it shipped. So I had quite a bit of work to tear down. After that, I moved home and made it pretty permanent here. We bought this place down here and then when we did that, it was wide open. We, at that point, when we moved down here, we were a hundred percent commercial cattle with some farming and then transitioned into the seedstock side.
Shaye Koester (05:36):
So you mentioned going home and helping your dad. Did you grow up on a commercial operation? What was the operation that you grew up on like? You said you're the fourth generation.
Steve Koester (05:44):
Yeah, my great grandfather moved here, I guess. I don't remember the year. That's kind of sad of me, but a long time ago and I came back and helped my dad and in return, I got to use some of his equipment to help me get started and we shared some pastures and some cattle and some bulls, and then just worked our way up from there. So, that's just kind of how we got going.
Shaye Koester (06:14):
So can you touch a little bit more on the operation that you're operating today? You said you started out a hundred percent commercial and you're now seed stock, but can you expand on your seedstock side that you're operating today?
Steve Koester (06:27):
Well, as you're aware when I got married and married into the Leland family, which is a registered Red Angus outfit in Montana. I was always intrigued about the quality of their cattle and the quality of the breed itself. I guess I'm always up for a challenge and there weren't many people raising fall-born seedstock and selling 18-month-old bulls this far north. And well, like I said, I've always liked a challenge. So we eased into it real slow and it's worked out really well. There's been a lot of challenges along the way. Learning curves have been huge, but I wouldn't say it's the most financially feasible way to raise seedstock. But, it works. It does work. And we've developed a pretty good customer base of people that really like the older age bulls.
Shaye Koester (07:38):
Okay. So you come from this commercial background and you were on the first episode where we talked about how you started your operation from scratch. So you started with commercial cattle, but worked to seedstock. So as you made that transition, what were the management differences between your commercial herd and your seedstock herd?
Steve Koester (07:57):
Well, there was quite a bit of difference there because our commercial herd was a spring calving herd. The fall calving herd of course we calve in August and September and we don't market those bulls until they're 18 months in the March bull sale. However, as far as how we handle the cattle, how we move them around or how we work them, that really hasn't changed. It's just a different season. From a seedstock side to a commercial side, there is quite a bit more labor-intensive. There are tremendous amounts of data we collect. Reproductively there's way more work. Now I'm not saying there aren't commercial herds out there that do a tremendous amount of work and data collection and do a lot of work on the repro side and kudos to them. Data is the key to the future. Data is the key and efficiency. But on the seedstock side, it's more of a mandate. So it really cuts into your time when you're, if you're used to spending X amount of hours doing this project on your ranch or that project on your ranch. You learn in a hurry that you've got to improvise and split that time because the cattle eat a lot of time.
Shaye Koester (09:35):
Well, absolutely. And like you said, it is, there are a lot of commercial producers who do collect that data, but it is more of the mandate on a seedstock side. So you talked about, you know, obviously, the management differences, because you switched from spring calving to fall calving on that side and then the data collection. But when you look at the ranches of business, how do those changes impact the business?
Steve Koester (10:00):
Well, it costs a lot of money. Every time you are working cattle. Generally, we need some extra help around here. Most time that's not free. I'd love it if it was pretty all the time, but as the old saying goes, there's no free lunch. It's more expensive is probably the big, the big one on that. If nothing else just, there's only so many hours in a day. So when you're doing one project, you're taking away from another project, we handle the cattle so much more. You need extra help. It goes back to just more data, more data, more data. For us to produce the best seedstock we can produce, we have to have all the data we can get our hands on so that we can sort the seedstocks that are siring the most profitable cattle. That's probably the main one.
Shaye Koester (11:02):
Okay. So what are the different challenges of each type of operation you've touched on like the time side of the seedstock, but what about the challenges that the commercial producers may face that the seedstock don't?
Steve Koester (11:21):
Wow. That's the million-dollar question right there. To me, when we had more commercial cattle, one of the biggest frustrations I had was the variation in our offspring. We tried our hardest to eliminate it and did a pretty good job. But with today's data, we can eliminate a little of that. From a commercial producer right now, to me, the challenge is variation in the quality of the end product. The more uniform we can make these cattle in phenotype, the more uniform we can make these cattle in efficiency and cutability and quality grade, it just takes so much risk out on the financial side for them. With the advances we've seen in the seedstock industry, I truly believe we're taking out a lot of that variability. If you're careful with your sire purchases, I really think we're taking a lot out.
Shaye Koester (12:44):
How has raising commercial cattle helped you as you raise seed stock?
Steve Koester (12:52):
Well, I touched on some of it. I am not a huge fan of variation in a calf crop. When we raised commercial cattle here and we still do to some degree, I still help my father with his commercial side. One thing that really helped is that we fed our own cattle out a time or two, maybe even a little more than that. We always tracked our cattle as far as we could track them. Now, that's not always possible and I understand that. But, finding out what your end product is, is probably the biggest key you can ever have, if you're going to try to move your cow herd to be more profitable. And I think that background really helped me as I moved forward in the seedstock side. Just putting it in a nutshell, that's probably the simplest answer I can give.
Shaye Koester (13:55):
Well, in that sense, you went from, you didn't start at the end of the supply chain, but as you move to seedstock, you kind of moved towards the beginning where you were working on supplying more, the genetics for the beef that would go into the supply chain.
Steve Koester (14:09):
Exactly. Yeah. What we focus on here is our end product all the time. We will never sacrifice the maternal aspect. Maternal traits are so important in the commercial side. That good maternal cow that breeds back every time on time, brings you in a live calf and a good calf good uddered and easy flashing; that's your base. You have to have that. You just, everything else after that is kind of syrup on your ice cream or whatever you want to call it. But it's crucial. Your end product is crucial and this industry needs to do in my opinion, needs to do a little better job making sure we know where that product's going to be when we put those calves on a pot.
Shaye Koester (15:06):
Absolutely. And traceability is a huge it's, it's been a hot topic for a long time, but it's interesting to see the technology that's coming out and the challenges the industry's facing with trying to implement that and everything.
Steve Koester (15:20):
We've been hearing the word traceability for a long time. But in my opinion, we've been hearing it so long that it's already here. If you don't believe me, go sell a really crappy set of feeder cattle and see if they come back to buy. They know where they came from. Traceability right now to me is just making it easier and easier to go back to the ranch and accountability is not a bad thing. It's a good thing if you're trying to move an industry forward.
Shaye Koester (15:53):
Well, absolutely. So shifting back to making that transition from commercial to seedstock, what would you say is one of the main challenges you faced on shifting your focus to the seedstock side?
Steve Koester (16:08):
Well, I guess I'd probably say when I shifted to the seedstock, probably the biggest challenge was thinking build it and they will come. It doesn't work that way. It's taken a lot of years to build a trust factor with the commercial industry. It takes a lot of years to find people within a commercial industry that have the same thought process because as you know, as you build a seedstock herd our thought process on what we consider the perfect cow, what we consider the perfect bull, what we consider the perfect end product that varies from ranch to ranch to ranch. But one thing that doesn't vary ever is profit. So once we got less variation in our cattle, the cattle are all profitable for the most part, the ones that aren't profitable are not seedstock. We started having a lot more success and it takes time. It does not happen overnight. It just takes time. So in a nutshell, I guess to sum it up, I would say building a customer base. But, the customer base is hard to come by and easily lost. It's a lot of work. And it's a lot of explaining what your principles, goals and thought processes are. That's probably the shortest version. There's a lot of metrics involved in it.
Shaye Koester (17:53):
Okay. So, and this kind of ties into what you just said with a challenge, but was there anything else you really didn't expect about the seedstock side when you transitioned to it? Was there anything that surprised you about it as you dove deeper into that business and committed?
Steve Koester (18:09):
The biggest one was the time, a tremendous amount of time. Your customers are calling and wanting help, wanting advice, or this worked, and this didn't work and help me get through this. And I love that. I truly enjoy that side of it and it's crucial. Like I said, I enjoy it, but the time that it consumes is maybe for lack of a better term, it's pretty astronomical and overwhelming. It's something you really need to prepare for if you're going to get into business. You know, you're out baling hay, raking hay, cutting hay, and the phone rings. Next thing you know, you're giving some advice on bloodlines or this or that, or the next thing. It eats up a lot of time.
Shaye Koester (19:07):
Oh, absolutely and business is about the people. So you need that customer service, but also on the seedstock side, I mean, you even look at gathering birth weights and are you taking extra DNA samples, some commercial producers take those DNA samples, but all those extra times through the chute and what you mentioned earlier in the interview about, you know, are you doing more on the reproduction side than you used to?
Steve Koester (19:31):
It all adds up. It eats up a lot of time and you know what, I'm not saying that I have all the answers, but I've got a little experience and I love helping people work through some things and whether that's from genetics or whatever, right. I don't claim to be a nutrition expert, but I can keep a cow alive. Well, we hope so this year in this drought but we'll be alright. Going back a little bit, I'll maybe add to that. That was probably one of the biggest challenges I had going to a seedstock fall calving herd. That's quite the nutritional challenge considering we're in North Dakota and it taken a long time to get that balance right. Nutrition was a huge part of that and it's quite different than a spring calving herd.
Steve Koester (20:41):
So as we kind of round out this conversation, you've really talked about the differences, but you've talked about how you work with commercial producers. So how can commercial producers best work with their seedstock supplier?
Steve Koester (20:56):
That is so simple. That answer to that is so simple. And it's one of the biggest problems we have, even as human beings. Communicate, communicate, and then communicate. Visit with your seed stock supplier, let them know what, what you want to change, what you want, don't want to mess with. I've had commercial producers say, I want this, but don't mess this up. And it's easy. It's not that hard. We have a tremendous suite of tools to work with. Just talk to your customers or if you're a commercial guy, talk to your seedstock supplier. If you want to try a new seedstock supplier, call them up and visit with them. See if you align with them or not. But that is so crucial. Then if you do purchase some cattle from them, just do a little follow-up call. The, "Hey, young bulls are holding up good." Or as a seedstock supplier call and ask, "How are the bulls holding up? Is there something I can do for you?" Communication is a two-way street. And to me, that is absolutely the biggest and best tool you can pull out of the tool chest.
Shaye Koester (22:24):
So then does that answer the next question of how can seedstock producers best work with their commercial clients?
Steve Koester (22:31):
Yes, I answered it previously and communication is absolutely key. As a seedstock supplier, we need to call and visit with our commercial customers. I'll turn this just a little bit. The commercial customers need to call the seedstock supplier to0. It's a two-way street. Communication goes both ways and we can't help a commercial producer. If the commercial producer doesn't tell us what they want help with. And I said this a little earlier too. With the suite of tools we have right now in the seedstock industry, it's phenomenal. We can help make the commercial producer more profitable or let's turn it the other way. The commercial producer absolutely can be more profitable if they just communicate with us and let us help them fill their niche need that they want fixed. We absolutely can do it. The industry is there. Everything need to do it is there.
Shaye Koester (23:48):
So as we round out the interview, do you have any last advice for someone who isn't sure if they want to get into the seedstock side of the beef industry?
Steve Koester (24:00):
Well, the real short version answer to that is if you're not sure don't do it. If you're not passionate about it, don't do it because there's plenty of rejection and pitfalls, just like any other business. I would say ease into it though, even if you're positive, ease into it. See if it's truly a fit for you because like we covered earlier there is a tremendous amount of labor time. You know, when everything's broke down on your ranch, that's the day when six commercial guys are going to call you and want to visit and you better do it. You better do it. Their success is your success. There is one more thing too. You better be talking to your creator every day. In anything you do check with him first, then check your passion. And if you still have it, go for it. It's a great business. It really is. It's a great business. I love it. I truly enjoy it. I love delivering bulls. I love getting on ranches. Yeah. I just love looking around and seeing how people do things. I'm still learning every day too. I learned a lot from our commercial industry and our customers and I hope they're learning too. It's a two-way street.
Shaye Koester (25:58):
Alright, well, thank you very much for being on the show today.
Steve Koester (26:02):
Not a problem.
Shaye Koester (26:10):
Alrighty, thank you again to Steve and for this episode's sponsor. I really appreciate being able to have both of them as a part of this podcast production. Now, I hope that you got as much out of that interview as I did, I guess I have the opportunity to listen to Steve a lot, but it was great to have him back on the show and to share his story and experiences with everyone. Please be sure to go find those social media posts or the comments section on whatever app you're listening to and let me know what you think or what you like. If there are more episodes you want to hear, let me know, and I will try and find someone to speak on those topics. Sometimes I can and sometimes I can't, but I do try. So with that, you have a great rest of your day and I hope to catch you on the next one.
Performance Beef (27:02):
This episode is brought to you by Performance Beef – easy-to-use cattle management software. Stop relying on pen and paper or complicated programs. Performance Beef is a comprehensive technology solution integrating feed, financial and health information in one easy-to-use platform, accessible from anywhere on your computer, smartphone or tablet. Performance Beef makes it easy to update rations; record health data at the chute, in the pen or out at pasture; generate real-time closeout reports; or analyze trends in feed intake, costs and performance – all in one place. It has helped more than 2300 cattle producers simplify their cattle business. Search Performance Beef online to request a demo or follow Performance Beef on social media. https://www.performancelivestockanalytics.com/performance-beef/
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